My music library library is much larger than my iPod's hard drive, but even before that, I've always preferred manually deciding what gets on my ipod and what doesn't. For me on my Mac, I have the FM scrob software. Every time I plug in the ipod, the Last.fm app will ask if I want to scrob tracks from my ipod.
Most people's libs are bigger than their ipod (and in fact, smart playlists are a great way to subset your collection on your ipod), but since you can always manually manage a dumb playlist that you would then automatically sync to your ipod, I fail to see the preference for manual management, except when you do not want to update your listening metadata in your library (which, as I said, I would expect is an unusual circumstance, but maybe not?).
I just want to decide how many and which bob dylan albums, etc to keep on my ipod. I use playlists especially since I listen to Classical, Jazz, electronic, whatever constitutes indie music anymore, etc. Finally made a recently added smart playlist.
Well, I could never think of one reason why you would want to autmatically manage your ipod. But that idea was settled on years ago when I got my first iPod and I haven't revisited the issue so maybe I'm missing something. I want to decide what goes on there, each song.
So now I manually managing but really, what a pain in the neck. Wanted just to add the current audiobook I'm listening to, not all of them, which involves making a special smart playlist for just that one book, then synching that playlist. Somewhat more annoying that the old drag and drop of manually managing. I will keep at automatically managing just to see how it goes but the greater simplicity and greater control is why people manually manage, kargatron, there's your answer. The ability to keep track of how many times you've listened to a track seems a dubious pay off imho for the increased fiddling around.
Is there a way to control what it chooses from when it automatically fills up the space? I assumed it would be a random shuffle-like selection but it appears to have gone alphabetically which ... do not want. How do I get rid of those songs I don't want from the automatic fill, as they are not in playlists to re-synch new versions of?
If you want to manually control everything on your ipod, it's completely available in an auto-sync by syncing one dumb playlist, whose contents you manage as you wish. That mimics manual ipod control, but allows playcount metadata to be tracked. Manual management does not copy metadata to your library, so you gain metadata tracking with no loss of functionality of you just auto-sync a single playlist.
But past that, you're free to play with smart playlists at will. The power of them becomes apparent when you try a few out. Say, a playlist of unheard tracks. Or 100 tracks of songs you've heard less than twice. Or 200 tracks you haven't heard in over a year. Or a combination. The great thing about smart playlists is that they stay smart/dynamic on the ipod. Play an 'unheard tracks' playlist. Go back to it some time later, and the tracks you heard earlier won't be on there.
My questions above are based on one point: you can exactly mimic manual management simply by choosing to sync one dumb playlist, and gain listening history tracking to boot. Manual management loses such tracking. So unless you actually want to lose that listening data, you're better off at least just syncing a single dumb playlist whose contents you manage just like you do the ipod now, and track your data "free of charge".
Alternatively, unless you really care about metadata there's no benefit to auto over manual. I'm ambivalent about it, last.fm is cool but I'm not losing sleep if people think I've listened to "Ode to Billy Joe" 20 instead of 35 times.
I'm with NankerP on this one.
Always managed my ipods manually, never saw the appeal/need for automating it. It just seemed to overcomplicate things for me.
Same with smart playlists, I have a few very simple ones but everything else I read about them seems to involve vastly higher levels of organisation and planning than my brain is usually ready to deal with.
As for play counts and other metadata, couldn't care less :-)
The process for me is simple.
Plug in ipod, add new tunes, sometimes remove older/less interesting stuff. Job done.
Oh, and the scrobbling thing seems to only randomly work for me to. But then I didn't ever really get into last.fm so it never bothered me.
Did you "manually manage my pod" users ever switch to syncing? The manually manage method has known bugs with scrobbling.
I have one non-smart playlist that I always sync to my ipod. It's called !gotta have it. The exclamation point makes it be at the top of the menu when I go from Music > Playlists on the ipod.
I add albums and whatnot to it, drag them around inthe order I want to hear things, right-click on the words !gotta have it and choose Copy to Play Order.
My other main playlist for my nano is a smart playlist called ~Fresh Mix. That is one of my all-time faves, got it from someone over on emusic a few years ago. It combines new stuff I've never listened to, with tracks I haven't listened to in a long time, with some top-rated tracks thrown in, using four playlists:
tracks recently added and not yet listened to,
some of my top rated,
old tracks that haven't been played recently and aren't rated,
top rated that haven't been played in a long time.
The playlists are weighted differently by "limit to 600MB selected by least recently played" or limit to 1200MB selected by highest rating", that sort of thing. Finally, the top-level ~Fresh Mix combines them all together and selects 100 songs randomly to go on the nano.
Even reading your new post about smart playlists etc makes my eyes glaze over and my brain explode.
Despite you saying it's fun, my brain just sees WORK.
:-)
I let iTunes manage my iPhone and only use smartlists to load the music; since I have only 16GB space is at a premium so this lets me have around the last two months of music purchases (I tag the store in the comments field along with the date ie eMusic-1010). When I buy another next year I am definitely going 32GB so I can have 4 months of purchases. ;-) As for my Nano, I just tell iTunes to fill it since it is for running/gym/mowing and I'm not really "listening".
And here I thought I was the only one that tagged purchase dates. Of course I go all out - eMusic.com 2010-10-20, etc. I like including the .com so that I can search for web purchases that way, since I'm also tagging rips.
Ah, see after the great Rip of 2009 I am done with that task. 99.9843% of my music over the past 6 years or so has been purchased digitally. I am so done with physical media. ;-)
@xtrev makes my eyes glaze over and my brain explode.
Ah. I thought you were made of sterner stuff, O leader of the emusers! Which by the way you are not in the group at lastfm...oh right, you are not a follower, you're a leader.
Anyhoo. I cannot tell you the pure FUN of hearing a favorite track I'd forgotten all about, and hadn't heard for 4 or 5 years.Yes, it's a bit of work to set up, but WORTH it.
I tried to friend somebody over there who has no plays, JUJ. Is it our very own JackedUpJazz? I wonder.
@thom and elwoodicious
Whoa. I thought I was being all over-tagging and too OCD when I tagged the eMu daily download tracks. I used to keep my music in different folders according to which source I got them from, but it got to be too much of a hassle after a while....I ended up having itunes consolidate everything in one folder. I started out using the Grouping field for eMusic purchases, before the had the downloader automatically add to the eMusic playlist.
Aha, now see? Gang of Four's "I Love A Man in a Uniform" just popped up in ~Fresh Mix!
We have a group? Who knew?
Joined it now, but I rarely use last.fm despite having scrobbling turned on most of the time.
Also, still never used ratings or play counts and gave up adding tags for where stuff came from ages ago (I used to keep downloads in separate folders too, but gave up for the same reason as you).
I joined the emusers group. You can find me on last.fm as: callmekenny
I like the site. I don't think I use it to its potential. I pretty much just use it to keep track of what I'm listening to. I like that it adds the play count of my iTunes and my phone's music player. Although, it's made me realize how much I listed to Sufjan and the National. In fact, it seems that's all I listen to.
....it's made me realize how much I listed to Sufjan and the National. In fact, it seems that's all I listen to.
I went through a Pixies kick, then later a Weepies kick, then a Morcheeba kick. It happens.
Right now I'm on a Dandy Worhols kick, for which I can thank Guvera.
Since my last contribution to this thread above, I have become a rabid convert to auto managing my iPhone - largely so it scrobbles to last fm more easily. I have a Recently Added smart playlist which is everything from the previous fortnight (mostly eMusic) so I get a good chance to listen to my acquisitions.
Ah, good to hear,Nank, good to hear. You have been assimilated.
I do recall being where xtrev is at - and you were probably there, too - figuring out smart playlists seemed like too much work.
My first few smart playlists were really quick ones to do a better search in my library - to find mistagged items, actually. Then I branched out.
Tagging BPMs and making workout playlists., jazz and classical for reading, boppy things for housework....
That ~Fresh Mix I've been raving about took the longest time to set up - probably a half hour to get it right to begin with, and another half hour's worth tinkering over the 2-3 years I've been using it. But oh, it's given back what I put into many times over!
Oh, and this has nothing to do with scrobbling, but iTunes...when I am listening on my ipod and something is wrong with a track (skips and needs re-ripping, lyrics are wrong, whatever) I give it a rating of 1 star. Got this idea from....I don't know where.
Then a smart playlist of 1-star tracks helps me get them fixed after a sync, snip-snap, Mary Poppins style.
Brings to mind a marvellous image of Katrina writing to artists...
Dear Mr Bono,
On listening to your song 'Vertigo', I found the opening lyrics "Uno, dos, tres, Catorce!" to be bafflingly incorrect.
Surely this should be "Uno, dos, tres, cuatro!", or am I missing some clever artistic intention of yours?
If you had used the correct version (cuatro), just think of the money you could have made advertising Audi cars!
There is one pro-sync argument that doesn't involve caring about metadata, and that's that syncing a dumb playlist gives you a list of what's on your ipod without having it connected, and control over what will end up on your ipod whenever you want (rather than hooking it up). Say you think of something you want added, but you don't have your ipod to hook up, you can just add it to the playlist, and it will go on when you do sync it, without having to remember at the time. It's a similar benefit to netflix queuing vs. trying to remember that movie you wanted when you actually enter the video store.
That's all separate from using smart playlists at all, or caring about tracking metadata.
@ kargatron
Exactly! That's the way I use my !gotta have it non-smart playlist.
@xtrev
Don't go cracking on U2! Haha. What I meant about "lyrics are wrong" was, one night while in my cups, I left the auto-fetch lyrics setting of EvilLyrics enabled.
Bad, bad move. It got HUNDREDS of wrong lyrics - not just bad misspellings or the wrong word here and there, but the completely wrong song, or in some cases, gibberish.
@everybody who scrobbles
I just got a message last night from lastfm that their scrobbling software had an update, so I installed it. Maybe it will fix some of the scrobbling bugs people have been seeing.
Oh, you're probably right. I just read "new scrobbling".
edit: I must confess, the link you posted? First line mentioned an Android, which I don't have and my eyes kinda glazed over. If you listen to Last.fm radio through the Last.fm desktop client or on an Android phone then ....
But I read the post AFTER that, by lastfm's DBA. WHat wonderful database geekery. Too bad one must be able to legally work in the UK to work at lastfm! What a fun database that dude gets to play with.
Anyway. DBA's post prompted me to listen to some Talk Talk.
Comments
Basically what I'm saying is that manual management is my way of being lazy.
Craig
Is there a way to control what it chooses from when it automatically fills up the space? I assumed it would be a random shuffle-like selection but it appears to have gone alphabetically which ... do not want. How do I get rid of those songs I don't want from the automatic fill, as they are not in playlists to re-synch new versions of?
But past that, you're free to play with smart playlists at will. The power of them becomes apparent when you try a few out. Say, a playlist of unheard tracks. Or 100 tracks of songs you've heard less than twice. Or 200 tracks you haven't heard in over a year. Or a combination. The great thing about smart playlists is that they stay smart/dynamic on the ipod. Play an 'unheard tracks' playlist. Go back to it some time later, and the tracks you heard earlier won't be on there.
My questions above are based on one point: you can exactly mimic manual management simply by choosing to sync one dumb playlist, and gain listening history tracking to boot. Manual management loses such tracking. So unless you actually want to lose that listening data, you're better off at least just syncing a single dumb playlist whose contents you manage just like you do the ipod now, and track your data "free of charge".
Smart playlists are absolutely, hands down, the best way to sync & use an ipod.
Always managed my ipods manually, never saw the appeal/need for automating it. It just seemed to overcomplicate things for me.
Same with smart playlists, I have a few very simple ones but everything else I read about them seems to involve vastly higher levels of organisation and planning than my brain is usually ready to deal with.
As for play counts and other metadata, couldn't care less :-)
The process for me is simple.
Plug in ipod, add new tunes, sometimes remove older/less interesting stuff. Job done.
Oh, and the scrobbling thing seems to only randomly work for me to. But then I didn't ever really get into last.fm so it never bothered me.
I bet it's closer to 77 times if you count all the ones on the radio!
Yeah. scrobbling isn't exact, or anything. It's for data nerds (like me).
I have one non-smart playlist that I always sync to my ipod. It's called !gotta have it. The exclamation point makes it be at the top of the menu when I go from Music > Playlists on the ipod.
I add albums and whatnot to it, drag them around inthe order I want to hear things, right-click on the words !gotta have it and choose Copy to Play Order.
My other main playlist for my nano is a smart playlist called ~Fresh Mix. That is one of my all-time faves, got it from someone over on emusic a few years ago. It combines new stuff I've never listened to, with tracks I haven't listened to in a long time, with some top-rated tracks thrown in, using four playlists:
tracks recently added and not yet listened to,
some of my top rated,
old tracks that haven't been played recently and aren't rated,
top rated that haven't been played in a long time.
The playlists are weighted differently by "limit to 600MB selected by least recently played" or limit to 1200MB selected by highest rating", that sort of thing. Finally, the top-level ~Fresh Mix combines them all together and selects 100 songs randomly to go on the nano.
Here's a similar version of it:
Fresh Mix on smartplaylists.com
Even reading your new post about smart playlists etc makes my eyes glaze over and my brain explode.
Despite you saying it's fun, my brain just sees WORK.
:-)
makes my eyes glaze over and my brain explode.
Ah. I thought you were made of sterner stuff, O leader of the emusers! Which by the way you are not in the group at lastfm...oh right, you are not a follower, you're a leader.
Anyhoo. I cannot tell you the pure FUN of hearing a favorite track I'd forgotten all about, and hadn't heard for 4 or 5 years.Yes, it's a bit of work to set up, but WORTH it.
I tried to friend somebody over there who has no plays, JUJ. Is it our very own JackedUpJazz? I wonder.
@thom and elwoodicious
Whoa. I thought I was being all over-tagging and too OCD when I tagged the eMu daily download tracks. I used to keep my music in different folders according to which source I got them from, but it got to be too much of a hassle after a while....I ended up having itunes consolidate everything in one folder. I started out using the Grouping field for eMusic purchases, before the had the downloader automatically add to the eMusic playlist.
Aha, now see? Gang of Four's "I Love A Man in a Uniform" just popped up in ~Fresh Mix!
We have a group? Who knew?
Joined it now, but I rarely use last.fm despite having scrobbling turned on most of the time.
Also, still never used ratings or play counts and gave up adding tags for where stuff came from ages ago (I used to keep downloads in separate folders too, but gave up for the same reason as you).
I like the site. I don't think I use it to its potential. I pretty much just use it to keep track of what I'm listening to. I like that it adds the play count of my iTunes and my phone's music player. Although, it's made me realize how much I listed to Sufjan and the National. In fact, it seems that's all I listen to.
....it's made me realize how much I listed to Sufjan and the National. In fact, it seems that's all I listen to.
I went through a Pixies kick, then later a Weepies kick, then a Morcheeba kick. It happens.
Right now I'm on a Dandy Worhols kick, for which I can thank Guvera.
I do recall being where xtrev is at - and you were probably there, too - figuring out smart playlists seemed like too much work.
My first few smart playlists were really quick ones to do a better search in my library - to find mistagged items, actually. Then I branched out.
Tagging BPMs and making workout playlists., jazz and classical for reading, boppy things for housework....
That ~Fresh Mix I've been raving about took the longest time to set up - probably a half hour to get it right to begin with, and another half hour's worth tinkering over the 2-3 years I've been using it. But oh, it's given back what I put into many times over!
Then a smart playlist of 1-star tracks helps me get them fixed after a sync, snip-snap, Mary Poppins style.
Brings to mind a marvellous image of Katrina writing to artists...
Dear Mr Bono,
On listening to your song 'Vertigo', I found the opening lyrics "Uno, dos, tres, Catorce!" to be bafflingly incorrect.
Surely this should be "Uno, dos, tres, cuatro!", or am I missing some clever artistic intention of yours?
If you had used the correct version (cuatro), just think of the money you could have made advertising Audi cars!
...etc
That's all separate from using smart playlists at all, or caring about tracking metadata.
Exactly! That's the way I use my !gotta have it non-smart playlist.
@xtrev
Don't go cracking on U2! Haha. What I meant about "lyrics are wrong" was, one night while in my cups, I left the auto-fetch lyrics setting of EvilLyrics enabled.
Bad, bad move. It got HUNDREDS of wrong lyrics - not just bad misspellings or the wrong word here and there, but the completely wrong song, or in some cases, gibberish.
@everybody who scrobbles
I just got a message last night from lastfm that their scrobbling software had an update, so I installed it. Maybe it will fix some of the scrobbling bugs people have been seeing.
I had the impression it had something to do with their new "mix tape" streaming channel.
edit: I must confess, the link you posted? First line mentioned an Android, which I don't have and my eyes kinda glazed over.
If you listen to Last.fm radio through the Last.fm desktop client or on an Android phone then ....
But I read the post AFTER that, by lastfm's DBA. WHat wonderful database geekery. Too bad one must be able to legally work in the UK to work at lastfm! What a fun database that dude gets to play with.
Anyway. DBA's post prompted me to listen to some Talk Talk.